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Sounds perfect Wahhhh, I don’t wanna
jordandwhiteqna

strejdaking asked:

If you are implying everyone who has been writing Spider-Man agrees with your interpretation, that simply not true. Admittedly, I can see why you, an actual person working in the industry, has hard time taking some guy on internet saying you and your coworkers are wrong seriously-but it's a fact that it's not just fans who think this. I ask you: Why are all the writers and fans who believe Spidey is about responsibility wrong? How is he about youth anymore than any character who started young?

jordandwhiteqna answered:

Ok, there are a lot of things to unpack in your question here. I will try to do my best to answer them as I can.

First off, and importantly so, I don’t edit the Spider-Man books. I have worked on a few odd Spidey books over the years, most of which were not in continuity. I do co-edit Spider-Man/Deadpool, but mostly because I am the Deadpool editor. I am, however, a lifelong Spider-Man fan who cares as passionately about Peter Parker and his life as any fan on here, I guarantee you that.

Naturally, not every person who worked on Spider-Man over the years agrees on every aspect of Spider-Man. If they did, things would have gone a lot more smoothly than they did, and there wouldn’t be so many bad stories–some of which exist purely to undo previous stories.

You’re setting up a false dichotomy in what the book is about. When I have said in the past that Spider-Man is about “youth” it’s not the word “youth” that is the important part. I am very much a “spirit of the law” not a “letter of the law” guy. To me, being about Youth and being about Responsibility are not in opposition, they are two sides of the same coin. It’s also about doing what’s right even when it costs you. It’s also about growing up, coming of age, and “adulting” as another commenter replied. To me, those are all part of one big thing. And there’s room for all of those things in Spider-Man, because he is resilient.

But there is a reason that every time a new “version” of Spider-Man comes out, they make him as young as possible–High School or College age. They don’t start from scratch as a 25 year old guy. and I don’t think that is just because that is where he started in the comics. It’s because at that age is where his central message is easiest to tell stories about.

Yes, you have responsibility for your entire life, not just when you are young. But when you’re young, it’s easier to forgive your mistakes as a learning experience. If you want to read stories about an adult making bad decisions, constantly screwing up his life and failing to learn the right lessons…well, good news! We publish that book, too, it’s called Deadpool, and I actually DO edit that one.

Back to your point that not everyone who worked on Spider-Man agrees that youth is an important component of his story, that’s fine. But it has been pretty widely agreed by most creators and editors who worked on Spider-Man since the marriage that it was a bad idea for the character. They tried SO MANY TIMES over the years to get rid of the marriage. That’s why the Clone Saga started! Then there was Mary Jane dying on a plane! Then the separation when she was in LA! They really wanted it out of there.

And look…I GET IT. Guess what–when I started reading Spider-Man…when I FELL IN LOVE WITH THE SERIES AND ITS CHARACTERS…when, and I’ve said this before, when the book SHAPED ME FUNDAMENTALLY to a degree where I would say it served as my RELIGION…when all that happened? Spidey was MARRIED TO MJ. And when I read those late 90s/early 2000s stories trying to break them up?  I was OUTRAGED. I was invested in their marriage! I cared about Peter and I cared about MJ, and it was TOTALLY LAME to just pretend they were never married, like they tried to do for a while there during the Mackie and JMS runs.

For me, though, the changeover happened when I read Kurt Busiek explain why the marriage was bad for Peter as a character, and it all clicked. I stopped viewing the issue as something happening to people that I knew and cared about and started seeing it as story decisions made in a story I cared about. And I saw that yeah…it really would have bee better for the story if they had never been married.

But you know what? It’s fine if you don’t see it that way. I ended up a comic book editor. Most readers, hopefully, will not…and as such have no NEED to look at the stories that way. They can just read them and decide if they liked them or not. And that is totally great.

So if you don’t like unmarried Peter, I am sorry. But the good news is, you can read Renew Your Vows, you can read old stories from before OMD, you can read old Spider-Girl comics…and if the bulk of the fans agree with you, then who knows? Maybe he will be married again in the main series. I don’t think that is likely to happen…but anything is possible.

And just to quickly cover some of the other arguments other people have sent at me that I have not replied to…I actually think Clark and Lois being married is EVEN WORSE for Superman that Spidey’s marriage was for him. I think it completely changed who Superman is irrevocably, and that bums me out because I preferred the old version–the way he is in the Silver-Age or in All-Star Superman.  Meanwhile, the marriage DID NOT ruin Fantastic Four…because Reed and Sue already played the role of “mother and father” in that series before the wedding.  And the marriage did not ruin Deadpool because that was just another thing for him to screw up badly.

jordandwhiteqna:

kurtbusiek:

Bam. Got another one.

But he’s wrong about Superman. Superman being married is flawed, but Spider-Man being married is worse. Flash, the Hawks, Reed & Sue, Vision & Wanda, those were all fine, though.

I explained yesterday why Superman was a little worse to me–that it changed who Clark was vs Superman, shifted the “real” self of him from Superman to Clark.  I feel like that change was more fundamental and more permanent than the change to Peter.  I honestly don’t think it’s likely Superman will ever go “back” to how he was before, whereas I am happy to have Peter single again and think it works well.

this explains/says a lot

jordandwhiteqna